While doing a little reading for one of my classes, I came across this little tidbit in a book called "The Tipping Point" by Malcolm Gladwell. When analyzing the Columbine shootings and those that followed, Mr. Gladwell came to the following conclusions concerning teens, peers and culture:
"My sense is that the way adolescent society has evolved in recent years has increased the potential for this kind of isolation. We have given teens more money, so they can construct their own social and material worlds more easily. We have given them more time to spend among themselves--and less time in the company of adults. We have given them e-mail and beepers and, most of all, cellular phones, so that they can fill in all the dad spots of their day--dead spots that might once have been filled in with the voices of adults--with the voices of their peers. That is a world ruled by the logic of word of mouth, by the contagious messages that teens pass among themselves. Columbine is now the most prominent epidemic of isolation among teenagers. It will not be the last."
Mr. Gladwell stresses the fact that in our time, teens are much more influenced by their peers than their parents. It may be time to update our terminology. We're no longer talking about peer pressure but peer control.
Well, parent, do you know who or what is controlling your teenager?
Just a thought.
Bro. Tom
Friday, August 10, 2012
Thursday, April 5, 2012
The Model of Antioch
Born in persecution, the church at Antioch is often referenced as the first place the disciples were known as “Christians” (Acts 11:26). That immediately marks it as special and worthy of note, having members who were so clearly and distinctively disciples of Christ as to be named after him. But that’s not the only reason they were special. The Bible gives us other reasons to pay attention to this local church and its practices.
First, we should notice it was a Gentile church. Specifically, the Bible says it was a church of Grecians (Acts 11:20). Saved through the preaching of persecuted Jews from Cyprus and Cyrene, we read that a “great number believed, and turned unto the Lord.” Here, we see something God would teach us through the church at Antioch. Understanding the message of Calvary to be for all men everywhere, they were able to overcome centuries of prejudice. Jews, orthodox, God-fearing, synagogue attending Jews did not associate much with Gentiles. Carrying over all the way from the entrance to Canaan, Jews believed all other races and nations to be inferior and cursed. The church at Antioch, under the leadership of the Holy Spirit of God, loved enough to reach beyond their prejudice and tradition.
Second, they were true disciples. Newly saved, they were so hungry for the Word of God that Barnabus had to go and get help to teach them. And what help! Paul, a converted Pharisee, linguist and preacher, came and helped teach the believers in Antioch. It was after a year of such teaching and obedience that they came to be called “Christians”.
Third, they were a giving church. Nowhere is the leadership of the Holy Spirit and the headship of Christ more readily apparent than in this matter of generosity. A Gentile church, previously persecuted by Jews, was led of the God to send financial assistance to the very ones who had earlier scorned them (Acts, 11:29; Romans 12:21).
Next, they were a praying church. In Acts 13, we find a list of church leaders along with the statement “as they ministered to the Lord, and fasted…”. Realizing their tremendous need for the Lord in everything they undertook, they regularly sought his face through times of prayer and fasting. They did not rely on their own wisdom, but cried out to God in humility and need, trusting Him to provide all things necessary for the success of His church.
Finally, we discover that the church at Antioch was chosen by God to be a sending church. Continuing in Acts 13, as they prayed and fasted, God spoke, directing them to separate Paul and Barnabus for a special misssion. The church at Antioch thus became the first missionary sending church.
Why did God choose the church at Antioch to be the sending agency for the first great missionary effort. It’s not hard to guess if you but look at their history. Here was a body of believers who loved the lost, followed hard after Jesus, was quick to give and quicker to pray. May God find us so.
Just a servant,
Bro. Tom
First, we should notice it was a Gentile church. Specifically, the Bible says it was a church of Grecians (Acts 11:20). Saved through the preaching of persecuted Jews from Cyprus and Cyrene, we read that a “great number believed, and turned unto the Lord.” Here, we see something God would teach us through the church at Antioch. Understanding the message of Calvary to be for all men everywhere, they were able to overcome centuries of prejudice. Jews, orthodox, God-fearing, synagogue attending Jews did not associate much with Gentiles. Carrying over all the way from the entrance to Canaan, Jews believed all other races and nations to be inferior and cursed. The church at Antioch, under the leadership of the Holy Spirit of God, loved enough to reach beyond their prejudice and tradition.
Second, they were true disciples. Newly saved, they were so hungry for the Word of God that Barnabus had to go and get help to teach them. And what help! Paul, a converted Pharisee, linguist and preacher, came and helped teach the believers in Antioch. It was after a year of such teaching and obedience that they came to be called “Christians”.
Third, they were a giving church. Nowhere is the leadership of the Holy Spirit and the headship of Christ more readily apparent than in this matter of generosity. A Gentile church, previously persecuted by Jews, was led of the God to send financial assistance to the very ones who had earlier scorned them (Acts, 11:29; Romans 12:21).
Next, they were a praying church. In Acts 13, we find a list of church leaders along with the statement “as they ministered to the Lord, and fasted…”. Realizing their tremendous need for the Lord in everything they undertook, they regularly sought his face through times of prayer and fasting. They did not rely on their own wisdom, but cried out to God in humility and need, trusting Him to provide all things necessary for the success of His church.
Finally, we discover that the church at Antioch was chosen by God to be a sending church. Continuing in Acts 13, as they prayed and fasted, God spoke, directing them to separate Paul and Barnabus for a special misssion. The church at Antioch thus became the first missionary sending church.
Why did God choose the church at Antioch to be the sending agency for the first great missionary effort. It’s not hard to guess if you but look at their history. Here was a body of believers who loved the lost, followed hard after Jesus, was quick to give and quicker to pray. May God find us so.
Just a servant,
Bro. Tom
Wednesday, March 2, 2011
Unsavory Salt
The recent decision by President Obama to instruct the Justice Department to stop defending the Defense of Marriage Act (DOMA) is only the latest salvo in the marginalization of the Church. This act, passed by Congress and signed by a previous president, is the law of the land. And yet, our president, who pledged in his oath of office to “preserve, protect, and defend the constitution of the United States” has undermined that very document by refusing to acknowledge the right of Congress, the elected representatives of the people, to make laws. His stated reason was his belief that the law was unconstitutional. Such a statement, by the leader of the executive branch, is in and of itself a flagrant disregard of the constitutional balance of power, in which the judicial branch is responsible for making such a determination.
The fact is that the President, a long-time supporter of homosexual rights, has chosen to hold in contempt any and every person who stands in opposition to his personal views on homosexuality. With no regard for the people’s voices as expressed in the fall 2010 election, President Obama and his advisors have chosen to thumb their noses at Christians and any other group that stands in defense of marriage as it was intended to be.
That being the case, the question not being asked is, “Where is the outrage?” Where are the calls for impeachment, the demonstrations, the rallying of support for that which is morally and biblically correct? At what point is enough...enough?
In the wake of “Roe vs. Wade”, there arose from within the Christian community a movement that eventually became known as the Christian right. The Moral Majority was universally hated by the liberals and socialists, yet it stood for right and made its voice heard. You may not agree with the methods of Randall Terry, but he has consistently raised his voice and helped others do the same in defense of the innocent unborn.
And yet in the wake of President Obama’s order to the Justice Department, we hear nothing. Even when President Obama appointed two of the most liberal pro-death judges ever to the Supreme Court, we heard nothing. Back in the 70s, Christian philosopher and apologist Francis Shaeffer identified the two overriding interests of western society as “personal peace and affluence”. In simple terms, “leave me alone, and give me enough money to do what I want.” Given the silence of the God’s people in the face of vicious attacks on what should be fundamental convictions of our faith, it seems these values have permeated the church as well.
Church, we must wake up, stand up and be counted for righteousness. We must do it wherever we are; at home, at work, in the community and especially at governmental meetings on every level. Our failure to do so can only result in the fulfillment of Jesus’ words in Matthew 5:15
“Ye are the salt of the earth: but if the salt have lost his savour, wherewith shall it be salted? it is thenceforth good for nothing, but to be cast out, and to be trodden under foot of men.”
Trodden under foot of men… You know, if I listen carefully, I swear I can hear the sound of jackboots.
Just a servant,
Bro. Tom
The fact is that the President, a long-time supporter of homosexual rights, has chosen to hold in contempt any and every person who stands in opposition to his personal views on homosexuality. With no regard for the people’s voices as expressed in the fall 2010 election, President Obama and his advisors have chosen to thumb their noses at Christians and any other group that stands in defense of marriage as it was intended to be.
That being the case, the question not being asked is, “Where is the outrage?” Where are the calls for impeachment, the demonstrations, the rallying of support for that which is morally and biblically correct? At what point is enough...enough?
In the wake of “Roe vs. Wade”, there arose from within the Christian community a movement that eventually became known as the Christian right. The Moral Majority was universally hated by the liberals and socialists, yet it stood for right and made its voice heard. You may not agree with the methods of Randall Terry, but he has consistently raised his voice and helped others do the same in defense of the innocent unborn.
And yet in the wake of President Obama’s order to the Justice Department, we hear nothing. Even when President Obama appointed two of the most liberal pro-death judges ever to the Supreme Court, we heard nothing. Back in the 70s, Christian philosopher and apologist Francis Shaeffer identified the two overriding interests of western society as “personal peace and affluence”. In simple terms, “leave me alone, and give me enough money to do what I want.” Given the silence of the God’s people in the face of vicious attacks on what should be fundamental convictions of our faith, it seems these values have permeated the church as well.
Church, we must wake up, stand up and be counted for righteousness. We must do it wherever we are; at home, at work, in the community and especially at governmental meetings on every level. Our failure to do so can only result in the fulfillment of Jesus’ words in Matthew 5:15
“Ye are the salt of the earth: but if the salt have lost his savour, wherewith shall it be salted? it is thenceforth good for nothing, but to be cast out, and to be trodden under foot of men.”
Trodden under foot of men… You know, if I listen carefully, I swear I can hear the sound of jackboots.
Just a servant,
Bro. Tom
Tuesday, January 5, 2010
Our Generation Summit
Every year for the past five I have had the privilege of taking a group of young people to the Our Generation Summit in Pigeon Forge, Tennessee during the holiday break. My first acquaintance with this group was at a summer camp at Fort Bluff, TN. There a group of college-aged young people had gathered together for the cause of world missions. My daughter was one of those young people, and I, as an interested father, went to the camp to check it out.
What I encountered there surprised and thrilled me. Here, under the banner of Baptists Committed to World Evangelism (BCWE) and the leadership of missionary-pastor Austin Gardner, was a small group of young people who sincerely believed they could evangelize the world in this generation. Not only did they believe it, they had plans to do it. Not only did they have plans, they had resources and manpower. Mostly, though, they had the enthusiasm and optimism of youth. And it was clearly contagious. A worker with youth at the time, I clearly saw the advantage of getting young people under the influence of this amazing group of missionaries. So began our trips to the Summit.
So what is a Summit, anyway? The Summit is a three-day meeting, beginning about noon on Thursday and ending at noon on Saturday. During that time, there are a number of sessions, more or less equally divided between joint sessions where everyone meets together and mini-sessions where the students are divided into small groups to study individual topics in more detail. For the 2009 meeting, such topics as Life on Life Discipleship, Media in Ministry, The Real Islam, Youth Directors and Missions, and Hudson Taylor were included in the mix. Joint sessions lasting up to three hours each were also conducted, and consisted of alternating periods of preaching, music (godly and inspirational; not carnal), and skits or videos produced by the Our Generation team.
The programs are well-prepared and effective, but it is not the programs that God uses to touch young hearts, it is the team. From the leader, Bro. Austin Gardner, all the way down to the newest student at the Our Generation Training Center, these are people who are passionate about world evangelism. They believe in a big God who is still doing big things, and they are not afraid to go out on a limb for Him or to encourage others to do so. There are no closed fields to this group, neither is there any vision too big. They dare to believe that when Jesus gave the Great Commission, He meant it for every Christian to go to every creature in every corner of the world.
The impact on young people is truly amazing. Challenged by straight talk and biblical teaching from men and women who are essentially their peers, our students respond. They begin to see that God not only can do something with their lives, His plan is far better than any they could devise themselves. IT LITERALLY CHANGES THEIR LIVES! F.B. Meyer could have been commenting on the Summit when he made this statement: “Fire the hearts of the young with all the beauty and blessedness of the service of Jesus, and they will not find it so hard to leave nets, and fishing boats, and friends, to forsake all and follow Him.”
The only sadness for me is that, even after five years, the meeting is not nearly as well-known or well-attended as it should be. The 2010 Our Generation Summit will be held again in Pigeon Forge from December 29, 2010 to January 1, 2011. Details will be available on their web site at ogsummit.info somewhere around the end of January, 2010. Pastor, Youth Pastor, Sunday school teacher, this year encourage your students to do something life-changing. Tell them, encourage them, plead with them, beg them if you must, but get them to the 2010 Summit. I guarantee a blessing waits.
Just a servant,
Bro. Tom
What I encountered there surprised and thrilled me. Here, under the banner of Baptists Committed to World Evangelism (BCWE) and the leadership of missionary-pastor Austin Gardner, was a small group of young people who sincerely believed they could evangelize the world in this generation. Not only did they believe it, they had plans to do it. Not only did they have plans, they had resources and manpower. Mostly, though, they had the enthusiasm and optimism of youth. And it was clearly contagious. A worker with youth at the time, I clearly saw the advantage of getting young people under the influence of this amazing group of missionaries. So began our trips to the Summit.
So what is a Summit, anyway? The Summit is a three-day meeting, beginning about noon on Thursday and ending at noon on Saturday. During that time, there are a number of sessions, more or less equally divided between joint sessions where everyone meets together and mini-sessions where the students are divided into small groups to study individual topics in more detail. For the 2009 meeting, such topics as Life on Life Discipleship, Media in Ministry, The Real Islam, Youth Directors and Missions, and Hudson Taylor were included in the mix. Joint sessions lasting up to three hours each were also conducted, and consisted of alternating periods of preaching, music (godly and inspirational; not carnal), and skits or videos produced by the Our Generation team.
The programs are well-prepared and effective, but it is not the programs that God uses to touch young hearts, it is the team. From the leader, Bro. Austin Gardner, all the way down to the newest student at the Our Generation Training Center, these are people who are passionate about world evangelism. They believe in a big God who is still doing big things, and they are not afraid to go out on a limb for Him or to encourage others to do so. There are no closed fields to this group, neither is there any vision too big. They dare to believe that when Jesus gave the Great Commission, He meant it for every Christian to go to every creature in every corner of the world.
The impact on young people is truly amazing. Challenged by straight talk and biblical teaching from men and women who are essentially their peers, our students respond. They begin to see that God not only can do something with their lives, His plan is far better than any they could devise themselves. IT LITERALLY CHANGES THEIR LIVES! F.B. Meyer could have been commenting on the Summit when he made this statement: “Fire the hearts of the young with all the beauty and blessedness of the service of Jesus, and they will not find it so hard to leave nets, and fishing boats, and friends, to forsake all and follow Him.”
The only sadness for me is that, even after five years, the meeting is not nearly as well-known or well-attended as it should be. The 2010 Our Generation Summit will be held again in Pigeon Forge from December 29, 2010 to January 1, 2011. Details will be available on their web site at ogsummit.info somewhere around the end of January, 2010. Pastor, Youth Pastor, Sunday school teacher, this year encourage your students to do something life-changing. Tell them, encourage them, plead with them, beg them if you must, but get them to the 2010 Summit. I guarantee a blessing waits.
Just a servant,
Bro. Tom
Thursday, December 17, 2009
The Real Christmas Story
And it came to pass in those days, that there went out a decree from Caesar Augustus, that all the world should be taxed. And this taxing was first made when Cyrenius was governor of Syria.) And all went to be taxed, every one into his own city. And Joseph also went up from Galilee, out of the city of Nazareth, into Judaea, unto the city of David, which is called Bethlehem; (because he was of the house and lineage of David:) To be taxed with Mary his espoused wife, being great with child.
And so it was, that, while they were there, the days were accomplished that she should be delivered. And she brought forth her firstborn son, and wrapped him in swaddling clothes, and laid him in a manger; because there was no room for them in the inn.
And there were in the same country shepherds abiding in the field, keeping watch over their flock by night. And, lo, the angel of the Lord came upon them, and the glory of the Lord shone round about them: and they were sore afraid. And the angel said unto them, Fear not: for, behold, I bring you good tidings of great joy, which shall be to all people. For unto you is born this day in the city of David a Saviour, which is Christ the Lord. And this shall be a sign unto you; Ye shall find the babe wrapped in swaddling clothes, lying in a manger. And suddenly there was with the angel a multitude of the heavenly host praising God, and saying, Glory to God in the highest, and on earth peace, good will toward men.
Luke 2:1-14
And so it was, that, while they were there, the days were accomplished that she should be delivered. And she brought forth her firstborn son, and wrapped him in swaddling clothes, and laid him in a manger; because there was no room for them in the inn.
And there were in the same country shepherds abiding in the field, keeping watch over their flock by night. And, lo, the angel of the Lord came upon them, and the glory of the Lord shone round about them: and they were sore afraid. And the angel said unto them, Fear not: for, behold, I bring you good tidings of great joy, which shall be to all people. For unto you is born this day in the city of David a Saviour, which is Christ the Lord. And this shall be a sign unto you; Ye shall find the babe wrapped in swaddling clothes, lying in a manger. And suddenly there was with the angel a multitude of the heavenly host praising God, and saying, Glory to God in the highest, and on earth peace, good will toward men.
Luke 2:1-14
Thursday, July 16, 2009
Biblical Church Discipline
Dear Ones:
The following message was posted by Mrs. Jamie Lonidier on the Grace Baptist Church Facebook page at 10:19 AM July 15. I have posted her message in its entirety for anyone who has not yet read it. My response is below her post. I apologize in advance for the length, but these are complex matters deserving more than a cursory explanation.
Bro. Tom
POSTING:
To all of you whom have inquired I am fine. I did something that went totally against what I believed to be right and just can't seem to forgive myself for it. I have betrayed my daughter and it grieves me everyday. Both her and I did something out of necessity instead of heart. She stood before a congregration to be humiliated to please a pastor and a dad and it has caused much anger and bitterness in her. I stood with her thinking the whole time of grabbing her hand and walking out, but was to much of a coward to do so. From day one I never agreed with her being publicly humilited and this has really broken my heart. Everyone of you have been extremly accepting and nice and this is greatily appreciated it I love you all. Also the majority of you have questioned as to why we would allow her to do this. I am comforted in knowing I am not the only one who thought this was totally wrong and uneccessary. The option was to do this or be voted out of Church either way it was going to be a public humiliation so she choose to face her accusers and be done with it. She did not want to put anyone in a position that could possiably divide the Church. I can not bring myself to go back to Grace at this time for I have no peace and bring with me a spirit that is hurting that dosen't belong there. The night the little Looney boy got up there and spoke on pride it really touched my heart and praised God saying this is my problem. I went to the altar and poured my heart out asking to please rid me of this pride and give me peace on what had transpired, but to my dissappointed it was not to be. I still feel like what was done was totally wrong. I always felt when a action does more harm than good you need to ask why it was done. I know there is another in the same situation and I ask that ya'll please pray about it before making her do this. She needs support and love not humiliation and hope things can be handle differently so as not to lose another one. God has truely blessed me with a husband who I think also sees now how it did more harm than good and is supported me in my decision on not going back. I read my bible and pray at home and worship my Lord. I will not attend another Church this is my husband wishes and so my church is at home. I must say it has been going well for I do spend more time in my Bible now. I feel we all need to remember that the Church is not whom we will answear to and so does not need to be asked the forgiveness of it's people. We answear to the Lord he is our savior and his forgiveness is the only one we need. Once that is done the church will forgive because they are a family who love the Lord. Remember we are all sinners is there anyone out there who wants to stand before a congregration annouce your hidden sin so all can stare and throw that stone I think not. Where are my daughters accusers? I it going to be awhile for me to forgive myself for betraying my daughter, but in the mean time I am going to be here to spport my daughter and love her with all my heart.
Please my door is always open and you are all welcome to come by maybe we can pray together for Gods wisdom in this I am open. You have been a wonderful family to worship with and I love you all.
Mrs. Jamie
RESPONSE:
It’s a little hard to begin to answer this one. Obviously Jamie has been deeply affected by both her daughter’s actions and the church’s response. It is now and will always be the responsibility of the church as her brothers and sisters in Christ to pray for her and to support her through difficult times, and we will continue to do so.
Even as we acknowledge our respect and love for her, there are things in this letter that must be addressed. To ensure that I am quoting correctly, I will post her letter in pieces, addressing some of those concerns as we go. My comments will be italics.
To all of you whom have inquired I am fine. I did something that went totally against what I believed to be right and just can't seem to forgive myself for it. I have betrayed my daughter and it grieves me everyday. Both her and I did something out of necessity instead of heart.
Jamie, I was very proud of you when you helped us convince Lizzie to take the step of public confession and restoration. I thought you must understand the actions taken were in the best interest of the not only the church and the Lord, but of Lizzie and a yet unborn child. I’m sure your influence was critical in bringing Lizzie to come forward, and as your pastor, I thank you for it. You did do right, as I will explain. You have no reason to forgive yourself.
She stood before a congregration to be humiliated to please a pastor and a dad and it has caused much anger and bitterness in her. I stood with her thinking the whole time of grabbing her hand and walking out, but was to much of a coward to do so. From day one I never agreed with her being publicly humilited and this has really broken my heart.
Jamie, this had nothing to do with the desires of either her pastor or her dad. This was a biblical process commanded by the Lord Jesus Christ and executed by His local church. For memory’s sake, let’s review it again.
In Matthew 18:15-17, the Lord Jesus laid the groundwork for discipline in the local church. It is a simple process, designed to deal with sin in the body and keep private things private. This process is formalized in the church by-laws, Article IV, Discipline of a Member. The by-laws are explicit concerning the process to be followed. They are line-by-line almost identical to Matthew 18:15-17, "Moreover if thy brother shall trespass against thee, go and tell him his fault between thee and him alone: if he shall hear thee, thou hast gained thy brother. 16 But if he will not hear thee, then take with thee one or two more, that in the mouth of two or three witnesses every word may be established. 17 And if he shall neglect to hear them, tell it unto the church: but if he neglect to hear the church, let him be unto thee as a heathen man and a publican."
This is the process that it typically followed. However, there is an exception. This is listed in Section 6 of the by-laws, which states, "No matter may be heard by the Discipline Committee or the church unless the steps outlined in Section 2 and 3 have been taken, except in the case of a public offense."
If there is an exception for a public offense, then there must be something special about those types of sins. This is most easily seen in 1 Corinthians 5:9-13. There was a particular sin within the congregation, a case of fornication, that was commonly and publicly known. Paul, in advising the congregation, told them explicitly in verse 11, "But now I have written unto you not to keep company, if any man that is called a brother be a fornicator, or covetous, or an idolater, or a railer, or a drunkard, or an extortioner; with such an one no not to eat." And then, in verse 13, "but them that are without God judgeth. Therefore put away from among yourselves that wicked person." There was no discussion, no need to pray about it. In the event of a public sin, there was to be public censure. As you put it, they were to be "voted out of the church".
The reason that the first two steps of the discipline process are skipped (by the way, we did not skip them) in the event of a public sin is that the reproach is already public. The actions of a member have dragged the church and her Lord through the mud and the damage is done. Any action from this point must be taken such that everyone aware of the sin is aware of the response. It is the same as if I offended a member personally. What if I recognized my error and confessed and repented to God, but not to the member? There is clearly no reconciliation. In the event of a public sin, such as fornication, there must be some effort on the part of the offender to reconcile with the offended. You can make the argument that Lizzie confessed and repented before God. This is wonderful and necessary. But God is not the only offended party. Every Christian (not just members of Grace) is affected by the sins of the brethren. Therefore, in such a casse, confession and repentance before the body are also necessary. It is the body of Christ, the church, that God has given to hold us accountable while we walk this earth.
In Lizzie’s case, this never came before the church for judgement, because she chose to confess and seek restoration from the body without making that step necessary. She did the right thing, although her actions since make it appear her motive may not have been genuine repentance.
Now, several times in the course of this letter you mention public humiliation. The point is not humiliation, but rather humility and restoration. To confess sin before a group, even a group that loves and cares for you, is never an easy thing. Most of us realize that even asking forgiveness from a spouse or family member requires some humility. The truth is that God blesses a humble heart. A humble heart is never humiliated. Only the proud suffer that. One who is genuinely broken over their sin will not be offended by confession and cleansing.
Everyone of you have been extremly accepting and nice and this is greatily appreciated it I love you all.
As you may recall, on the night that Lizzie came before the church, the longest message was to the body. As Lizzie had done her part in asking forgiveness, it was now our part to extend forgiveness and to restore the erring member (2 Cor. 2:7-8). We are commanded to love one another, just as we are commanded to hold one another accountable. The purpose of discipline is not punishment, but restoration. It is always done in love.
Also the majority of you have questioned as to why we would allow her to do this. I am comforted in knowing I am not the only one who thought this was totally wrong and uneccessary.
Anyone who still does not understand should read the comments above carefully and prayerfully study the Scriptures given.
The option was to do this or be voted out of Church either way it was going to be a public humiliation so she choose to face her accusers and be done with it.
If Lizzie came to "get it over with", she came for the wrong reason. As for the humiliation, I’ve already addressed that.
She did not want to put anyone in a position that could possiably divide the Church.
Only sin (pride) can divide a church (Proverbs 13:10).
I can not bring myself to go back to Grace at this time for I have no peace and bring with me a spirit that is hurting that dosen't belong there. The night the little Looney boy got up there and spoke on pride it really touched my heart and praised God saying this is my problem. I went to the altar and poured my heart out asking to please rid me of this pride and give me peace on what had transpired, but to my dissappointed it was not to be. I still feel like what was done was totally wrong. I always felt when a action does more harm than good you need to ask why it was done.
One must be very careful passing judgment on the results of a biblical process. You are assuming that because some are experiencing distress and discomfort, the process must be flawed. God frequently does things that disturb us, and always for our good and His glory. There are many things that might cause us to lose our peace, but obeying His clearly revealed Word is not one of them.
I know there is another in the same situation and I ask that ya'll please pray about it before making her do this. She needs support and love not humiliation and hope things can be handle differently so as not to lose another one.
God’s Word hasn’t changed, and his church dare not change it. Public sin will be dealt with publicly in love and humility with the purpose of restoration.
God has truely blessed me with a husband who I think also sees now how it did more harm than good and is supported me in my decision on not going back. I read my bible and pray at home and worship my Lord. I will not attend another Church this is my husband wishes and so my church is at home.
It is commendable that you have chosen to submit to your husband in this matter.
I must say it has been going well for I do spend more time in my Bible now. I feel we all need to remember that the Church is not whom we will answear to and so does not need to be asked the forgiveness of it's people. We answear to the Lord he is our savior and his forgiveness is the only one we need. Once that is done the church will forgive because they are a family who love the Lord.
Here is the appropriate point to be reminded of the words of Jesus in Matthew 5:23-24, "Therefore if thou bring thy gift to the altar, and there rememberest that thy brother hath aught against thee; Leave there thy gift before the altar, and go thy way; first be reconciled to thy brother, and then come and offer thy gift." Jesus’ teaching is clear. There is no point in trying to bring a sacrifice to God while you are at odds with your brother. Clearly we are accountable to one another. God’s forgiveness is not all we need. We must also have peace with our brethren.
Remember we are all sinners is there anyone out there who wants to stand before a congregration annouce your hidden sin so all can stare and throw that stone I think not. Where are my daughters accusers? I it going to be awhile for me to forgive myself for betraying my daughter, but in the mean time I am going to be here to spport my daughter and love her with all my heart.
Interesting thought. In 1 Timothy 5:20, the Bible says, "Them that sin rebuke before all, that others may fear." One of the purposes of the discipline process is to help others realize that they, too, will be held accountable. That realization should and will result in holier lives.
Jamie, the things that were done were done Biblically, lovingly and humbly. There was not then, nor is there now, any spirit of animosity or accusation. Lizzie chose to reject the clear teachings of the Word of God concerning her relationships and her conduct, and to do in a very public manner. It is the responsibility of the church to correct erring members (Gal. 6:1). In correcting Lizzie, we proved our love. It is the responsibility of us all to love Lizzie and to help her and others in similar situations, but that does not include supporting, condoning, or encouraging an openly sinful lifestyle.
Please my door is always open and you are all welcome to come by maybe we can pray together for Gods wisdom in this I am open. You have been a wonderful family to worship with and I love you all.
Mrs. Jamie
It is unfortunate that this had to be played out in such a public forum. I had hoped the issue was properly dealt with and done. I am deeply saddened by the apparent misunderstanding of and reluctance to engage in what is clearly a biblical mandate. I strongly encourage anyone who is still struggling with this issue to prayerfully consider the Scripture passages mentioned. In the event of continued confusion, I will be happy to meet with you and discuss it.
Pray for Jamie and her family.
Just a servant,
Bro. Tom
The following message was posted by Mrs. Jamie Lonidier on the Grace Baptist Church Facebook page at 10:19 AM July 15. I have posted her message in its entirety for anyone who has not yet read it. My response is below her post. I apologize in advance for the length, but these are complex matters deserving more than a cursory explanation.
Bro. Tom
POSTING:
To all of you whom have inquired I am fine. I did something that went totally against what I believed to be right and just can't seem to forgive myself for it. I have betrayed my daughter and it grieves me everyday. Both her and I did something out of necessity instead of heart. She stood before a congregration to be humiliated to please a pastor and a dad and it has caused much anger and bitterness in her. I stood with her thinking the whole time of grabbing her hand and walking out, but was to much of a coward to do so. From day one I never agreed with her being publicly humilited and this has really broken my heart. Everyone of you have been extremly accepting and nice and this is greatily appreciated it I love you all. Also the majority of you have questioned as to why we would allow her to do this. I am comforted in knowing I am not the only one who thought this was totally wrong and uneccessary. The option was to do this or be voted out of Church either way it was going to be a public humiliation so she choose to face her accusers and be done with it. She did not want to put anyone in a position that could possiably divide the Church. I can not bring myself to go back to Grace at this time for I have no peace and bring with me a spirit that is hurting that dosen't belong there. The night the little Looney boy got up there and spoke on pride it really touched my heart and praised God saying this is my problem. I went to the altar and poured my heart out asking to please rid me of this pride and give me peace on what had transpired, but to my dissappointed it was not to be. I still feel like what was done was totally wrong. I always felt when a action does more harm than good you need to ask why it was done. I know there is another in the same situation and I ask that ya'll please pray about it before making her do this. She needs support and love not humiliation and hope things can be handle differently so as not to lose another one. God has truely blessed me with a husband who I think also sees now how it did more harm than good and is supported me in my decision on not going back. I read my bible and pray at home and worship my Lord. I will not attend another Church this is my husband wishes and so my church is at home. I must say it has been going well for I do spend more time in my Bible now. I feel we all need to remember that the Church is not whom we will answear to and so does not need to be asked the forgiveness of it's people. We answear to the Lord he is our savior and his forgiveness is the only one we need. Once that is done the church will forgive because they are a family who love the Lord. Remember we are all sinners is there anyone out there who wants to stand before a congregration annouce your hidden sin so all can stare and throw that stone I think not. Where are my daughters accusers? I it going to be awhile for me to forgive myself for betraying my daughter, but in the mean time I am going to be here to spport my daughter and love her with all my heart.
Please my door is always open and you are all welcome to come by maybe we can pray together for Gods wisdom in this I am open. You have been a wonderful family to worship with and I love you all.
Mrs. Jamie
RESPONSE:
It’s a little hard to begin to answer this one. Obviously Jamie has been deeply affected by both her daughter’s actions and the church’s response. It is now and will always be the responsibility of the church as her brothers and sisters in Christ to pray for her and to support her through difficult times, and we will continue to do so.
Even as we acknowledge our respect and love for her, there are things in this letter that must be addressed. To ensure that I am quoting correctly, I will post her letter in pieces, addressing some of those concerns as we go. My comments will be italics.
To all of you whom have inquired I am fine. I did something that went totally against what I believed to be right and just can't seem to forgive myself for it. I have betrayed my daughter and it grieves me everyday. Both her and I did something out of necessity instead of heart.
Jamie, I was very proud of you when you helped us convince Lizzie to take the step of public confession and restoration. I thought you must understand the actions taken were in the best interest of the not only the church and the Lord, but of Lizzie and a yet unborn child. I’m sure your influence was critical in bringing Lizzie to come forward, and as your pastor, I thank you for it. You did do right, as I will explain. You have no reason to forgive yourself.
She stood before a congregration to be humiliated to please a pastor and a dad and it has caused much anger and bitterness in her. I stood with her thinking the whole time of grabbing her hand and walking out, but was to much of a coward to do so. From day one I never agreed with her being publicly humilited and this has really broken my heart.
Jamie, this had nothing to do with the desires of either her pastor or her dad. This was a biblical process commanded by the Lord Jesus Christ and executed by His local church. For memory’s sake, let’s review it again.
In Matthew 18:15-17, the Lord Jesus laid the groundwork for discipline in the local church. It is a simple process, designed to deal with sin in the body and keep private things private. This process is formalized in the church by-laws, Article IV, Discipline of a Member. The by-laws are explicit concerning the process to be followed. They are line-by-line almost identical to Matthew 18:15-17, "Moreover if thy brother shall trespass against thee, go and tell him his fault between thee and him alone: if he shall hear thee, thou hast gained thy brother. 16 But if he will not hear thee, then take with thee one or two more, that in the mouth of two or three witnesses every word may be established. 17 And if he shall neglect to hear them, tell it unto the church: but if he neglect to hear the church, let him be unto thee as a heathen man and a publican."
This is the process that it typically followed. However, there is an exception. This is listed in Section 6 of the by-laws, which states, "No matter may be heard by the Discipline Committee or the church unless the steps outlined in Section 2 and 3 have been taken, except in the case of a public offense."
If there is an exception for a public offense, then there must be something special about those types of sins. This is most easily seen in 1 Corinthians 5:9-13. There was a particular sin within the congregation, a case of fornication, that was commonly and publicly known. Paul, in advising the congregation, told them explicitly in verse 11, "But now I have written unto you not to keep company, if any man that is called a brother be a fornicator, or covetous, or an idolater, or a railer, or a drunkard, or an extortioner; with such an one no not to eat." And then, in verse 13, "but them that are without God judgeth. Therefore put away from among yourselves that wicked person." There was no discussion, no need to pray about it. In the event of a public sin, there was to be public censure. As you put it, they were to be "voted out of the church".
The reason that the first two steps of the discipline process are skipped (by the way, we did not skip them) in the event of a public sin is that the reproach is already public. The actions of a member have dragged the church and her Lord through the mud and the damage is done. Any action from this point must be taken such that everyone aware of the sin is aware of the response. It is the same as if I offended a member personally. What if I recognized my error and confessed and repented to God, but not to the member? There is clearly no reconciliation. In the event of a public sin, such as fornication, there must be some effort on the part of the offender to reconcile with the offended. You can make the argument that Lizzie confessed and repented before God. This is wonderful and necessary. But God is not the only offended party. Every Christian (not just members of Grace) is affected by the sins of the brethren. Therefore, in such a casse, confession and repentance before the body are also necessary. It is the body of Christ, the church, that God has given to hold us accountable while we walk this earth.
In Lizzie’s case, this never came before the church for judgement, because she chose to confess and seek restoration from the body without making that step necessary. She did the right thing, although her actions since make it appear her motive may not have been genuine repentance.
Now, several times in the course of this letter you mention public humiliation. The point is not humiliation, but rather humility and restoration. To confess sin before a group, even a group that loves and cares for you, is never an easy thing. Most of us realize that even asking forgiveness from a spouse or family member requires some humility. The truth is that God blesses a humble heart. A humble heart is never humiliated. Only the proud suffer that. One who is genuinely broken over their sin will not be offended by confession and cleansing.
Everyone of you have been extremly accepting and nice and this is greatily appreciated it I love you all.
As you may recall, on the night that Lizzie came before the church, the longest message was to the body. As Lizzie had done her part in asking forgiveness, it was now our part to extend forgiveness and to restore the erring member (2 Cor. 2:7-8). We are commanded to love one another, just as we are commanded to hold one another accountable. The purpose of discipline is not punishment, but restoration. It is always done in love.
Also the majority of you have questioned as to why we would allow her to do this. I am comforted in knowing I am not the only one who thought this was totally wrong and uneccessary.
Anyone who still does not understand should read the comments above carefully and prayerfully study the Scriptures given.
The option was to do this or be voted out of Church either way it was going to be a public humiliation so she choose to face her accusers and be done with it.
If Lizzie came to "get it over with", she came for the wrong reason. As for the humiliation, I’ve already addressed that.
She did not want to put anyone in a position that could possiably divide the Church.
Only sin (pride) can divide a church (Proverbs 13:10).
I can not bring myself to go back to Grace at this time for I have no peace and bring with me a spirit that is hurting that dosen't belong there. The night the little Looney boy got up there and spoke on pride it really touched my heart and praised God saying this is my problem. I went to the altar and poured my heart out asking to please rid me of this pride and give me peace on what had transpired, but to my dissappointed it was not to be. I still feel like what was done was totally wrong. I always felt when a action does more harm than good you need to ask why it was done.
One must be very careful passing judgment on the results of a biblical process. You are assuming that because some are experiencing distress and discomfort, the process must be flawed. God frequently does things that disturb us, and always for our good and His glory. There are many things that might cause us to lose our peace, but obeying His clearly revealed Word is not one of them.
I know there is another in the same situation and I ask that ya'll please pray about it before making her do this. She needs support and love not humiliation and hope things can be handle differently so as not to lose another one.
God’s Word hasn’t changed, and his church dare not change it. Public sin will be dealt with publicly in love and humility with the purpose of restoration.
God has truely blessed me with a husband who I think also sees now how it did more harm than good and is supported me in my decision on not going back. I read my bible and pray at home and worship my Lord. I will not attend another Church this is my husband wishes and so my church is at home.
It is commendable that you have chosen to submit to your husband in this matter.
I must say it has been going well for I do spend more time in my Bible now. I feel we all need to remember that the Church is not whom we will answear to and so does not need to be asked the forgiveness of it's people. We answear to the Lord he is our savior and his forgiveness is the only one we need. Once that is done the church will forgive because they are a family who love the Lord.
Here is the appropriate point to be reminded of the words of Jesus in Matthew 5:23-24, "Therefore if thou bring thy gift to the altar, and there rememberest that thy brother hath aught against thee; Leave there thy gift before the altar, and go thy way; first be reconciled to thy brother, and then come and offer thy gift." Jesus’ teaching is clear. There is no point in trying to bring a sacrifice to God while you are at odds with your brother. Clearly we are accountable to one another. God’s forgiveness is not all we need. We must also have peace with our brethren.
Remember we are all sinners is there anyone out there who wants to stand before a congregration annouce your hidden sin so all can stare and throw that stone I think not. Where are my daughters accusers? I it going to be awhile for me to forgive myself for betraying my daughter, but in the mean time I am going to be here to spport my daughter and love her with all my heart.
Interesting thought. In 1 Timothy 5:20, the Bible says, "Them that sin rebuke before all, that others may fear." One of the purposes of the discipline process is to help others realize that they, too, will be held accountable. That realization should and will result in holier lives.
Jamie, the things that were done were done Biblically, lovingly and humbly. There was not then, nor is there now, any spirit of animosity or accusation. Lizzie chose to reject the clear teachings of the Word of God concerning her relationships and her conduct, and to do in a very public manner. It is the responsibility of the church to correct erring members (Gal. 6:1). In correcting Lizzie, we proved our love. It is the responsibility of us all to love Lizzie and to help her and others in similar situations, but that does not include supporting, condoning, or encouraging an openly sinful lifestyle.
Please my door is always open and you are all welcome to come by maybe we can pray together for Gods wisdom in this I am open. You have been a wonderful family to worship with and I love you all.
Mrs. Jamie
It is unfortunate that this had to be played out in such a public forum. I had hoped the issue was properly dealt with and done. I am deeply saddened by the apparent misunderstanding of and reluctance to engage in what is clearly a biblical mandate. I strongly encourage anyone who is still struggling with this issue to prayerfully consider the Scripture passages mentioned. In the event of continued confusion, I will be happy to meet with you and discuss it.
Pray for Jamie and her family.
Just a servant,
Bro. Tom
Thursday, January 22, 2009
Read at Your Own Risk
Read at Your Own Risk
I have had the privilege of reading many, many books in my life. Of them, there is a short list that, in my opinion, should come with a warning label. The label would say something like this, “WARNING. READING THIS BOOK WILL CHANGE THE WAY YOU THINK AND LIVE! READ AT YOUR OWN RISK!” While on a personal retreat recently, I read such a book. It was called Ramblings from North Africa, and was written by an American missionary, his wife and a Peruvian co-worker.
Ramblings from North Africa is a brief autobiographical sketch of a missionary’s first year in the
First, this is a story about calling and perseverance. God has called them to one of the most difficult mission fields in the world. The writers rarely complain directly, the difficulties are rather felt and understood through the reading. Consider:
- a country where it is illegal to convert to another faith,
- a country where it is illegal to share another faith,
- a country where it is illegal to possess a Bible in the native language,
- a country where everyone, by law, shares a faith historically antagonistic to Christianity.
These are the institutional obstacles to their work. Now add the cultural obstacles, such as:
- a language that is one of the most difficult in the world to learn,
- local assemblies that live in fear and mistrust any foreigner,
- Muslim neighbors and friends who are constantly trying to convert you.
- the standard missionary fare: strange food, strange customs, strange attitudes, strange laws, strange everything,
- a housekeeper who stops in the middle of her day to recite prayers toward
- and on and on…
The way these young people deal with these issues reveals a great deal about their call. They are willing to look foolish, sound foolish, yeah, even be foolish for the sake of the very people who are abusing them. Although fear lurks around them, their refusal to surrender to it is a testimony to the grace of God that brought them there and keeps them there. Knowing the risk, they witness, pass out Bibles, meet as a church. They don’t put up billboards, but they do share Christ (the fact that their names are omitted from both the book and this article is just simple precaution). They refuse to let fear rule their ministry.
Second, this book is powerful in its openness. These little glimpses into the lives of these missionaries reveal them to be people, no more and no less. They are servants of the Most High God, doing what He would have them do. They resist the fear, they call out unto God, they experience frustration and they fail. They sometimes succumb to the temptation of the flesh to scream out, “But what about me?!” And each time, with the Lord’s help, they get up and go on.
And God is blessing them. The real bulk of the book is made up of how God is working through them to reach Muslims in
Finally, this book is most powerful in the realization that it could have been written by me or you. I happen to have met this couple, and I know beyond any shadow of a doubt they love God. They love Him and they are surrendered to Him. They spent time preparing, and now they are in a “closed” country sharing Jesus. They are special, but they aren’t any more special than you and me.
Our dear brother, in the preface for the book, listed his purposes for writing it.
1) For future missionaries (whether you know it or not) who will be helped by knowing some of our struggles and victories, mistakes and successes. I wish I could have known what things we would likely face before arriving.
2) For Pastors who send their young people to Muslim fields. The Pastor has the charge to lead his people into the battlefields and support with understanding those sent ones.
3) The church member who is passionate about missions. We hope you find that we are just normal people like you who are privileged to work in missions full time.
4) For college students who are praying about what God wants them to do with their lives and where he wants them to do it. We hope your heart will break like ours for the 1.3 billion Muslims. They are the greatest challenge in missions today.
5) For supporters who we want to thank for your love, prayers and financial gifts to allow us to live out Christ’s love for Muslims. We hope you can know us personally and our joint mission better through this book.
I am confident the book will serve all these purposes, and more. I came away from the book with a renewed sense of the greatness of God, a renewed vision for a world I had previously considered by and large unreachable, and an intense desire to be used of God where I am now. Like I said, read at your own risk.
Just a servant,
Bro. Tom
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